Solo Oboe in a Mix.. or Live

[Steve Lum]

Or any other "small" instrument for that matter. Standing up an oboe solo melody against a supporting orchestra almost surely means using some artificial means to boost that signal up to front-of-mix levels. I wonder what folks do after the expression and dynamic level are already full scale and the wee fellow just can't bust through. Artificially push beyond 0db? Otherwise augment with e.g. parallel compression ? Duck competing frequency ranges?

Although it helps with presence, multiple seats doesn't sound like solo any longer.

And then I think about a real orchestra - must the arrangement always "back off" to let the solo player have room? Do they ever artificially mic the player to let sound reinforcement help out?

Click to read more...

 

[FireGS]

Do they ever artificially mic the player to let sound reinforcement help out?

Spot mics are definitely used. Orchestrating around the soloist tends to help, too.

But dont try to balance an Oboe with fullo strings and brass at FF - thats just not going to work or sound right.

 

[marclawsonmusic]

Could be an orchestration issue.

If other instruments are playing in that same frequency range, they might mask the oboe. Or, if the rest of the orchestra is playing at too high a dynamic, it might get drowned out. Oboe can normally cut through fairly well. What else do you have playing? Can you post an audio example?

 

[germancomponist]

Spot mics are definitely used. Orchestrating around the soloist tends to help, too.

But dont try to balance an Oboe with fullo strings and brass at FF - thats just not going to work or sound right.

This!

Good example

 

[ryans]

Artificially push beyond 0db?

Oh yeah, push it.

 

[Polkasound]

Spot mics can be used to bring the instrument more out in front. For oboes, however, I would recommend this particular mic:

 

[germancomponist]

Spot mics can be used to bring the instrument more out in front. For oboes, however, I would recommend this particular mic:

 

[Sid Francis]

I got a pair of them and they are really really quiet!

 

[Steve Lum]

I got a pair of them and they are really really quiet!

you crazy kids !

 

[Casiquire]

This is certainly an example of the importance of good orchestration. Oboe solos predate microphones

 

[SupremeFist]

Oboes should be seen and not heard.

 

[Steve Lum]

Some context: I am not a pro, I'm a former prog rocker and these days I write dense (ok, jokes about dense allowed) prog orchestral stuff (but I can be light and delicate as needed) so I am often placing lines in ways that would likely never ever happen in a classical setting, so by definition I start square one with an 'orchestration issue'. Now, I get it, Oboes are not really meant to compete with soaring synthesizer leads, but they can if your imagination lets you think/hear it.

But a current real-world re-mix effort did get me thinking about what 'modern' orchestras do for solos.

An absurd thought experiment to attempt to illustrate - Trans-Siberian Orchestra with an Oboe solo over a hard-driving background.

 

[marclawsonmusic]

I completely get it.

IMHO I would still think of it as an orchestration / arrangement thing if at all possible. So before reaching for an EQ to notch out something in the oboe range - or a compressor to put it 'on top' - maybe see if there is another instrument playing in that range that could 'stop speaking' so the oboe can have its moment.

You might also consider high-passing the oboe so no low frequencies are getting into the mix, and/or consider putting a high shelf so the top end cuts through more.

But in the end, it's tough to make concrete suggestions without hearing an audio sample.

Anyway, hope there's something in there that helps! Wishing you the best.

 

[Steve Lum]

Anyway, hope there's something in there that helps!

Always ! The best part of waking up is Folger's... no, that's not it... it's hanging with the VI C crowd.

(So you're saying that Hammond B3 holding those chord stacks with the leslie full tilt might cover the little double-reed guy?) (joking... maybe)

 

[David Cuny]

I'd suggest you think of this as a "focus" issue.

If you want your listener to be able to hear the oboe solo, you need to guide them to focusing on that element.

Think of an orchestral sketch - the basic musical functions are broken out as:

- Melody
- Counter melody
- Harmony
- Rhythm

Sure, the roles can be assigned to different groupings of instruments over time, but as a rule of thumb, there's only one melody at a time.

Consider of how a counter-melody is distinct from a melody: when one is active, the other is generally less active. Make it easy for your listener to hear the important bits.

Similarly, while harmony has a rhythmic and melodic element, it's done in a way that signals to the listener that it's not the main point of focus. A non-orchestral example would be a rhythm guitar - it can play a cool and varied strum pattern, but it better not overshadow the melody.

If you want an instrument to have a melody, the other instruments need to be relegated to roles that are subservient to the melody, so the listener can shift their focus.

If you want attention on the oboe, why would the orchestra be going full scale? You're signalling to the listener that they should be listening to the big, loud orchestra. What clue have you given them that they're supposed to be paying attention to the oboe?

Imagine bringing the whole orchestra to a sudden halt and then bringing in the oboe. That would be effective!

Keeping other instruments out of the melody instrument's range is just good arranging. Sure, if you've got a piano competing with a vocalist in the same register, you can try to EQ space in the mix. Or you can tell the piano player stay out of the vocalist's register and try accompanying them instead of soloing.

So yes - orchestrate things is a way that make it easy for the listener to focus on what you want them to hear. Focus can move from one instrument to the next, but at any one point in time, your listener should be able to confidently know what they're supposed to be paying attention to.


And if you really can't remove the competing frequencies from the mix, you can use something like TrackSpacer that'll do the work for you.