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Realistic orchestration and double stops

To be clear, I never said don't use fifths, only understand why they are almost always a challenge. My biggest point to non string players is that even the melodic interval of a fifth, when NOT DOUBLE STOPPED, in some cases poses exactly the same challenge as a double stopped fifth. And the only way to grasp why this is, is to get a rudimentary understanding of how string fingerings work - to that end I'm not a fan of lists and tables in orchestration books, because whether or not something is possible is irrelevant - it's whether you can get to it and away from it again that matters, and makes something either idiomatic, difficult or unplayable.

And as I mentioned, if you have short, fat and stubby fingers, double stopped fifths are much less of a problem - provided you can get to it and away from it in an efficient manner.

I'm happy we had this talk! It's been driving me crazy for years that no one seems to understand this, but hopefully that's about to change.
 
double stopped root and 5th in the low register
That's generally no problem, and you can often safely write fifths in the low register on violin and viola as well. If it can be played with the 1st or 2nd finger in 1st position, I doubt anyone will have much trouble with it - but again, only if you can get to it and away from it efficiently.
 
Consider James Newton Howard's "Signs" score, which if I remember right has solo strings along with the section. I am pretty sure I remember double stops.

I confirm and I approve. Signs has amazing strings sonorities
 
Apologies for adding to a seemingly finished thread but I was just reading through and thought to add a couple of things to the reasons already noted why a 5th is perhaps the most difficult interval to play in tune on a violin in case anybody is interested...

When you play a note on a string, by pressing it down onto the fingerboad you stretch the string.
Different makes/models of string are affected in differing amounts by this stretch - for example, a high tension steel core string will stretch at a different rate (in terms of pitch change) than a low tension perlon core, aluminium wound string. That is, a 2mm stretch of one string will result in a different amount of pitch change to a 2mm stretch of a different string.

Violinsts (and other string players) use a mix of strings for a huge number of reasons. With my violin, for example, if I use the same tension and structure string for all of them, the D string doesn't speak very clearly. If I use a higher tension G then the D speaks more clearly but that affects the tone of the A string so I also need to use a different type of A string to get a closer match in tone across the instrument.

The thickness and tension of strings obviously also has an impact on the pitch change to stretch ratio. An E string will change in pitch more than the G string when stretched the same amount.

Added to this, the height of adjacent strings above the fingerboard will most likely be slightly different even on the most well set up of instruments. (This is usually at least in part a deliberate thing for various boring reasons).

So not only do you have to contend with trying to place a single finger equally on 2 strings when the angle of the finger makes that difficult to do so, you must also compensate for differing effects of pitch change due to string stretch and different amounts of physical string stretch on those strings.

This problem is far less on a cello or double bass due to the length of the strings but is a real issue for violinists.

If I play a 5th and change the amount of pressure on each string the pitch change can be up to +/- a semitone on each string without moving my finger along the string, just by changing how much I'm pressing on one string compared to the other.

Another reason to avoid them for a single player is to do with tone quality.
When you place a finger on the string it should be curled over with the tip of the finger pressing onto the string.
The tip of the finger pressed firmly creates a fairly hard edge and produces the clearest sound because it allows the string to vibrate relatively unimpeded. If you place a finger either not firmly, or use the pad rather than the tip of the finger, you will get a rubbish sound which will not sustain because the fuzzy edge acts like a blanket on the string and stops it vibrating efficiently.
Now if you imagine double stopping - using 2 fingers means you can get 2 clearly defined notes because each finger can play in its tip. Using a single finger across 2 strings (like when playing a 5th) means you can't get that good tone because by necessity you are having to use more of the pad than the tip of the finger.
As you move out of 1st position, this problem increases because the strings physically get further apart and you have to use a 'flatter' finger more and more.
 
So writing realistically is not a priority for me but I'd like to know this in case I wanna do it in the future. I was wondering today if strings can play octaves on the same instrument. Apparently it's possible on a violin, but then I wondered what's the maximum distance between two notes on a double stop for each instrument? I would imagine for basses and cellos it's harder because of the largest distances between the "frets"? Does the same apply to their ranges, ie is a double stop narrower the higher up the fretboard you go?

Yes I know about divisi. Just curious about this, especially the octaves

Nao,

Excellent advice here so far. If I may, I'd like to refer you to 2 of my own pieces if you feel inclined to listen. These works are concert works, one atonal the other tonal, both performed live and utilising all manner of stops. You may find them interesting, but no sweat if you don't bother.
If you go to the link below you will find 2 scrolling score movies (the first two at the top of the page). At 8'50'' ish in the first movie (sonata for violin and piano - atonal-ish!) you will find perfect fifths tremeloes used as an effect and in the second movie (Partita - the tonal work), multiple stops were purposely used almost incessantly throughout the whole work for all 3 players (string trio). Mighrt be useful for you, at least to hear the effect of stop work in action and for real.

https://mikehewer.com/page-3/
 
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