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Orchestration Recipes Discussion Thread

Hey @PhilipJohnston ! Vol 4 is really great ! I just finished to re-watch the first section : "elevated major". This is realllllly interesting ! One observation though : since everything is explained with such a great level of details, I was surprised that you don't say a word about the harmonic resolution of the example n°5... Or did I miss something? Great work anyway !
 
Just purchased Volume 2. Great product. Can someone help me categorize the mood of each recipe - like happy, adventurous, sad, suspense.. etc.Thanks in advance.
 
lionandrew said:
Just purchased Volume 2. Great product. Can someone help me categorize the mood of each recipe - like happy, adventurous, sad, suspense.. etc.Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
I'd say
22: heroic, bloodthirsty
23: mysterious, thoughtful
24: heroic, hectical
25: mysterious, wondrous, advernterous
26: spooky, dangerous
27: sad, thoughtful,
28: hectical, chasing, dangerous
29: mysterious
30: suspense, spooky
31: hectical, anxious
32: sad
33: mysterious, wondrous, advernterous
34: spooky, suspense crittery (ok, this is not a real adjective, but I hear spiders, scorpions, snakes ...)
35: hectical, engaging
36: sad, melancholic
37: mysterious, suspense, unease
38: advernterous
39: suspense, hectical
40: magical, adventurous
41: hectical, panicking
42: mysterious

Hope that helps
 
romantic said:
I'd say
22: heroic, bloodthirsty
23: mysterious, thoughtful
24: heroic, hectical
25: mysterious, wondrous, advernterous
26: spooky, dangerous
27: sad, thoughtful,
28: hectical, chasing, dangerous
29: mysterious
30: suspense, spooky
31: hectical, anxious
32: sad
33: mysterious, wondrous, advernterous
34: spooky, suspense crittery (ok, this is not a real adjective, but I hear spiders, scorpions, snakes ...)
35: hectical, engaging
36: sad, melancholic
37: mysterious, suspense, unease
38: advernterous
39: suspense, hectical
40: magical, adventurous
41: hectical, panicking
42: mysterious

Hope that helps
Click to expand...
thanks a lot ...
 
In your recipes lessons you constantly refer to working in the DAW. I prefer to use Dorico. It might be nice in the future to mention both DAWs and notation programs. :)
 
@Midimaster - you've made a good point here, and you're not the first to ask. Not everyone prefers to work in a DAW (or, for that matter, with software of any sort).

Complicating things still further: some composers only work with notation, others cannot read music; some have postgraduate levels of harmony-ninja-superpowers from a lifetime of jazz, others know three chords by ear, a dozen others by reputation, and wouldn’t recognise a Lydian scale if it asked them out on a date.


This makes creating educational material uniquely challenging, and means a huge slice of development time is spent iterating designs for how to communicate the information—ahead of the very first release, I actually spent more time in Figma and Indesign than I did in Logic Pro.

That said, I don’t think Orchestration Recipes initially got this balance quite right; the videos in Volumes 1 and 2 in particular were very heavily DAW focused. (Although for DAW users, those videos are a very fast way to get up to speed on an idea)

Volumes 3 and 4 take a different approach. Everything's narrated, using metaphors that require little assumed knowledge, but that still aim to respect knowledge the viewer might already have.

The concepts are then illustrated with kind of a musical holy trinity:

• A DAW piano roll
• Traditionally notated scores
• Keyboard showing exactly what’s being played

(…although I still had one user complaining that they were nonetheless finding Orchestration Recipes confusing, because they couldn’t read music, couldn’t play an instrument, knew nothing about theory, hadn't listened to much orchestral music, so were not really familiar with the instruments, and didn’t own a DAW...Sir, if I may, there’s a Monty Python bookshop sketch you need to watch)

TLDR:
Those who compose using notation software will be just fine with Orchestration Recipes.

I also believe that as notation software continues to lift its game for rendering credible mockups, more and more composers will work that way. For many composers there's nothing quite like being able to see the notes as you work (myself included).

Otherwise, I really appreciate the input. I do carefully read everything here, even if I don’t always respond. (VI Control is actually like one giant committee that helps me iterate all this...so if you have ideas, please post! You may well see them in future releases.)
 
The solution I came up with was to just load the midi files for Vols 1 and 2 into Dorico when I wanted to see the notation

Especially since I would be creating my own examples using Dorico anyway so I don't see the problem
 
PhilipJohnston said:
@Midimaster - you've made a good point here, and you're not the first to ask. Not everyone prefers to work in a DAW (or, for that matter, with software of any sort).

Complicating things still further: some composers only work with notation, others cannot read music; some have postgraduate levels of harmony-ninja-superpowers from a lifetime of jazz, others know three chords by ear, a dozen others by reputation, and wouldn’t recognise a Lydian scale if it asked them out on a date.


This makes creating educational material uniquely challenging, and means a huge slice of development time is spent iterating designs for how to communicate the information—ahead of the very first release, I actually spent more time in Figma and Indesign than I did in Logic Pro.

That said, I don’t think Orchestration Recipes initially got this balance quite right; the videos in Volumes 1 and 2 in particular were very heavily DAW focused. (Although for DAW users, those videos are a very fast way to get up to speed on an idea)

Volumes 3 and 4 take a different approach. Everything's narrated, using metaphors that require little assumed knowledge, but that still aim to respect knowledge the viewer might already have.

The concepts are then illustrated with kind of a musical holy trinity:

• A DAW piano roll
• Traditionally notated scores
• Keyboard showing exactly what’s being played

(…although I still had one user complaining that they were nonetheless finding Orchestration Recipes confusing, because they couldn’t read music, couldn’t play an instrument, knew nothing about theory, hadn't listened to much orchestral music, so were not really familiar with the instruments, and didn’t own a DAW...Sir, if I may, there’s a Monty Python bookshop sketch you need to watch)

TLDR:
Those who compose using notation software will be just fine with Orchestration Recipes.

I also believe that as notation software continues to lift its game for rendering credible mockups, more and more composers will work that way. For many composers there's nothing quite like being able to see the notes as you work (myself included).

Otherwise, I really appreciate the input. I do carefully read everything here, even if I don’t always respond. (VI Control is actually like one giant committee that helps me iterate all this...so if you have ideas, please post! You may well see them in future releases.)
Click to expand...
For me all orchestrationrecipes, incl. Vol 1 and 2, worked perfectly in combination with staffpad..
 
PhilipJohnston said:
...so if you have ideas, please post! You may well see them in future releases.
Click to expand...
This was the last thing I read last night before I went to sleep. During my slumber, I had a vivid dream that I was in your house helping you with an IT networking problem (before you phone the police, I’ll clarify that I’d don’t actually know where you live!). There were a lot of other people in your house too all waiting for your new Orchestration Recipes presentation, but you couldn’t begin until I’d fixed your IT issues. As I was helping you diagnose the problem, I suggested it would be cool if there was a Dorico script that would scan some music and tell me which herbs, spices and other exotic ingredients were used to create this particular dish — sort of like a reverse recipe search.

So that’s my idea, or rather, my unconscious mind’s idea communicated to me via a dream. I guess this would be purely educational to see how other composers handled the ingredients within their dish.
 
romantic said:
I'd say
22: heroic, bloodthirsty
23: mysterious, thoughtful
24: heroic, hectical
25: mysterious, wondrous, advernterous
26: spooky, dangerous
27: sad, thoughtful,
28: hectical, chasing, dangerous
29: mysterious
30: suspense, spooky
31: hectical, anxious
32: sad
33: mysterious, wondrous, advernterous
34: spooky, suspense crittery (ok, this is not a real adjective, but I hear spiders, scorpions, snakes ...)
35: hectical, engaging
36: sad, melancholic
37: mysterious, suspense, unease
38: advernterous
39: suspense, hectical
40: magical, adventurous
41: hectical, panicking
42: mysterious

Hope that helps
Click to expand...
Great post! Did anyone categorise volume 1?
 
davidson said:
Great post! Did anyone categorise volume 1?
Click to expand...
Here are my two cents.

I:
01: HEROIC choral bisque with infused pianoforte
dramatic, rhythmic
02: PERIOD DRAMA stringed oboe ravioli in HAYDN sauce
classic, classic
03: NOSTALGIC horn parisienne with tremolo jus
Lyrical, peaceful, level-headed
04: DARK strings consommé with brass pad coulis
suspense, mysterious, suspense, mysterious
05: LILTING winds SHIRE frittata on a pizzicato salad bed
smooth, repetitive,
06: Harp and string confit d'ÉGYPTIENNE
calm, exotic, egyptian, arabic, calm, exotic, egyptian, arabic
07: GRAND TUTTI in Mannheim marinade
classic, classic
08: ENGLISH DETECTIVE bassoon escalops with scurrying flute-string pan-bagnat
comedic, light, rhythmic
09: OMINOUS strings à la broche
dark, wagnerian, mysterious
10: MELANCHOLIC oboe croquettes with harp tureen
nostalgic, thoughtful, calm, sad
11: FULL MOON viola cassoulet with MIDNIGHT woodwind relish
mysterious, nostalgic, thoughtful, quiet, sad, mysterious, nostalgic, thoughtful, calm, sad
12: OTHERWORLDLY sordino string blanquette with paired woodwind poêlé
space, mysterious, otherworldly, mysterious
13: Brass FANFARED au gratin with running winds
majestic, military, majestic, majestic, military, majestic
14: Filled SCI-FI planing-trumpets on a low string bed
exciting, dark, star wars, exciting, dark, star wars
15: ETHEREAL string quenelle with piano & wind frit
exciting, mysterious, wonder, a treasure
16: SOARING string Saint-Jacques in a trombone reduction
Adventure, driving, exploring, adventure, driving, exploring
17: EPIC choir bouillabaisse with chattering brass ragout
epic, adventure, rhytmic, striding, star wars, epic, adventure, rhytmic, striding, star wars
18: STING-LENGTH horn-string crepes with glockenspiel en jelly
rhythmic momentum, news flash, western, positive, americana, adventure, rhythmic momentum, news flash, western, positive, americana, adventure
19: STATELY wind GRADUATION clafoutis
carrying, noble, majestic, striding, celebration
20: DARK ENERGY riffed brassy cello mousse
impending danger, menacing, action, adventure, rhythmic, impending danger, menacing, action, adventure, rhythmic
21: PRE-BATTLE horn bavarios with snare au chocolat
preparing, marching, military, adventure, preparing, marching, military, adventure

II:
22: Heroes! assemble!
heroic, superhero, rhythmic, avengers
23: Glade of Echoes
calm, compassionate, sorrow, love
24: Ready the archers; bar the gates
Action, suspense, star wars, rhythmic
25: The Valleys of Ildyria
calm, peaceful, magical, enchanted, harry potter
26: Stalactites of the Ice Witch
exciting, danger, thriller, crime, basic instinct
27: Two years, to the day
memories, sadness, rest
28: You can't outrun the hounds
fast, pursuit, action, star wars, danger, rhythmic
29: Breakfast is served at the Manor
quiet, historic, noble, noble
30: Old rug. Hidden trap door.
quiet, mysterious, secretive, exciting, dungeon
31: Make haste. Warn the villagers.
imminent danger, epic, exciting, rhythmic
32: The Princess is laid to rest
classic, classy
33: Exploring the reef
water, calm, positive, impression, wonder
34: We shouldn't have camped in this forest
exciting, mysterious, secretive
35: Trouble at the docks
crime, action, police, rhythmic
36: Melancholy transition
significant, melancholic moment, quiet, mysterious
37: Workshop of the Demented Clocksmith
danger, tension, crazy, rhythmic
38: My seventh summer, my first bike
A kid, a new bike, and a carefree summer day to fill, child, positive, comedic, rhythmic, adventure, light
39: Helter Skelter
chaotic, bursty, fleeing & tagging, hiding and gotchas, action, rhythmic, suspense, crime
40: The wombat doesn't like snow
comedic, child, light
41: Scramble the pilots
frenetic, adrenaline-infused feel, action, star wars, adventure
42: The train to St Katherine's School of Illusions
Trains, kids, and journey to a magic school, driving, rhythmic, light
 
WillMah Gold said:
Here are my two cents.

I:
01: HEROIC choral bisque with infused pianoforte
dramatic, rhythmic
02: PERIOD DRAMA stringed oboe ravioli in HAYDN sauce
classic, classic
03: NOSTALGIC horn parisienne with tremolo jus
Lyrical, peaceful, level-headed
04: DARK strings consommé with brass pad coulis
suspense, mysterious, suspense, mysterious
05: LILTING winds SHIRE frittata on a pizzicato salad bed
smooth, repetitive,
06: Harp and string confit d'ÉGYPTIENNE
calm, exotic, egyptian, arabic, calm, exotic, egyptian, arabic
07: GRAND TUTTI in Mannheim marinade
classic, classic
08: ENGLISH DETECTIVE bassoon escalops with scurrying flute-string pan-bagnat
comedic, light, rhythmic
09: OMINOUS strings à la broche
dark, wagnerian, mysterious
10: MELANCHOLIC oboe croquettes with harp tureen
nostalgic, thoughtful, calm, sad
11: FULL MOON viola cassoulet with MIDNIGHT woodwind relish
mysterious, nostalgic, thoughtful, quiet, sad, mysterious, nostalgic, thoughtful, calm, sad
12: OTHERWORLDLY sordino string blanquette with paired woodwind poêlé
space, mysterious, otherworldly, mysterious
13: Brass FANFARED au gratin with running winds
majestic, military, majestic, majestic, military, majestic
14: Filled SCI-FI planing-trumpets on a low string bed
exciting, dark, star wars, exciting, dark, star wars
15: ETHEREAL string quenelle with piano & wind frit
exciting, mysterious, wonder, a treasure
16: SOARING string Saint-Jacques in a trombone reduction
Adventure, driving, exploring, adventure, driving, exploring
17: EPIC choir bouillabaisse with chattering brass ragout
epic, adventure, rhytmic, striding, star wars, epic, adventure, rhytmic, striding, star wars
18: STING-LENGTH horn-string crepes with glockenspiel en jelly
rhythmic momentum, news flash, western, positive, americana, adventure, rhythmic momentum, news flash, western, positive, americana, adventure
19: STATELY wind GRADUATION clafoutis
carrying, noble, majestic, striding, celebration
20: DARK ENERGY riffed brassy cello mousse
impending danger, menacing, action, adventure, rhythmic, impending danger, menacing, action, adventure, rhythmic
21: PRE-BATTLE horn bavarios with snare au chocolat
preparing, marching, military, adventure, preparing, marching, military, adventure

II:
22: Heroes! assemble!
heroic, superhero, rhythmic, avengers
23: Glade of Echoes
calm, compassionate, sorrow, love
24: Ready the archers; bar the gates
Action, suspense, star wars, rhythmic
25: The Valleys of Ildyria
calm, peaceful, magical, enchanted, harry potter
26: Stalactites of the Ice Witch
exciting, danger, thriller, crime, basic instinct
27: Two years, to the day
memories, sadness, rest
28: You can't outrun the hounds
fast, pursuit, action, star wars, danger, rhythmic
29: Breakfast is served at the Manor
quiet, historic, noble, noble
30: Old rug. Hidden trap door.
quiet, mysterious, secretive, exciting, dungeon
31: Make haste. Warn the villagers.
imminent danger, epic, exciting, rhythmic
32: The Princess is laid to rest
classic, classy
33: Exploring the reef
water, calm, positive, impression, wonder
34: We shouldn't have camped in this forest
exciting, mysterious, secretive
35: Trouble at the docks
crime, action, police, rhythmic
36: Melancholy transition
significant, melancholic moment, quiet, mysterious
37: Workshop of the Demented Clocksmith
danger, tension, crazy, rhythmic
38: My seventh summer, my first bike
A kid, a new bike, and a carefree summer day to fill, child, positive, comedic, rhythmic, adventure, light
39: Helter Skelter
chaotic, bursty, fleeing & tagging, hiding and gotchas, action, rhythmic, suspense, crime
40: The wombat doesn't like snow
comedic, child, light
41: Scramble the pilots
frenetic, adrenaline-infused feel, action, star wars, adventure
42: The train to St Katherine's School of Illusions
Trains, kids, and journey to a magic school, driving, rhythmic, light
Click to expand...
Awesome, thanks :)
 
Forgive me if I missed it, but are there any complete examples of recipes anywhere? Just to get an idea if the total format and depth of each one? I know the shortened videos on YouTube and those are helpful. Just curious if any full examples were available. Deciding which volumes to consider!

Brent
 
koolkeys said:
Forgive me if I missed it, but are there any complete examples of recipes anywhere? Just to get an idea if the total format and depth of each one? I know the shortened videos on YouTube and those are helpful. Just curious if any full examples were available. Deciding which volumes to consider!

Brent
Click to expand...
orchestrationrecipes.com

Orchestration Recipes Homepage

Sign in Contact Store Vol 1 & 2: Recipes Instrumental combinations that work Add to your collection Vol 1 & 2:
orchestrationrecipes.com

Just scroll down, there are 5 free recipes (vol1 and vol2)
 
@koolkeys - I've just added Recipe 24 as a free preview to the orchestrationrecipes.com homepage, including the accompanying PDF desk reference.

There's also loads of audio examples of the harmonic "spices" covered in Volumes 3 & 4, together with a video walkthrough of that new format (shown below):



From all of that, you'll have a pretty good picture of format and focus of the series so far. All up, there's just over 80 orchestrated walkthroughs so far, together with 10 different cinematic harmonic "spices", to recast those orchestrations in fresh colours and moods.

Nothing for Volume 5 yet, it's currently cooking. Got distracted by The Icon Project (it took way longer than I will ever own up to, but it really is going to make all upcoming OR videos much clearer)
 
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The teaching style and content of these courses appeals to me very much! However, as a starving hobbyist I need to carefully plan my meager black Friday budget. Can we expect a sale this month?
 
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