Enharmonic equivalent question
- Thread starter John Wilson
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NoamL
Winter <3
This is exactly perfect the way you wrote it.
There are three things to keep in mind:
1. All musicians like to read accidentals that clarify when the notes all belong to the same scale or harmony. Even if that scale changes from measure to measure. So what you've done is perfect. If you for instance, spelled measure 33 with Ab and E natural, respelling a straightforward major 3rd as a strange diminished 4th, this would definitely confuse the musicians more and is a bad idea.
2. Strings (and I believe all musicians?) like reading accidentals that go "in the direction of travel." So a rising line should favor sharps, and a descending line flats. BUT! this should NOT trump the previous rule that if a passage belongs to a particular key, spell it with that key's notes. So the rising scale at the beginning of your passage is correct to spell with flats.
3. In general strings like reading sharps a bit more than flats. And this is the weakest rule of all and should not trump rules 1 and 2.
There are three things to keep in mind:
1. All musicians like to read accidentals that clarify when the notes all belong to the same scale or harmony. Even if that scale changes from measure to measure. So what you've done is perfect. If you for instance, spelled measure 33 with Ab and E natural, respelling a straightforward major 3rd as a strange diminished 4th, this would definitely confuse the musicians more and is a bad idea.
2. Strings (and I believe all musicians?) like reading accidentals that go "in the direction of travel." So a rising line should favor sharps, and a descending line flats. BUT! this should NOT trump the previous rule that if a passage belongs to a particular key, spell it with that key's notes. So the rising scale at the beginning of your passage is correct to spell with flats.
3. In general strings like reading sharps a bit more than flats. And this is the weakest rule of all and should not trump rules 1 and 2.
JJP
Did you know Mike Greene owns a llama? 🦙
I would like to emphasize Noam’s “weakest rule” comment. This has sometimes been incorrectly interpreted as “strings prefer sharps, so write their parts in sharps wherever possible,” resulting in ludicrous parts. No sight-reading musician wants to see f-minor respelled as e#-minor!
Living Fossil
Senior Member
Two things:
- on its own, I would notate the third bar as Ab-Fb. Switching to sharps just to avoid Fb isn't really helpful. A musician is not a moron who can't read the basics...
- in the end the notation of Fb/E depends on the harmonic context. If the underlying harmony is a C7/b13 chord the correct notation would be Ab-E.
Allthough a diminished 4th isn't the most usual interval it would be crucial to indicate to the musician that E is a leading tone.
JJP
Did you know Mike Greene owns a llama? 🦙
Thinking on this a little more, there are situations where I may keep the A-flat and put a courtesy on the E-natural. One example would be a keyboard part where the E-natural sounds like a major 7th creating an Fm(ma7) harmony. Another example would be an A-flat augmented harmony. Keyboard players often think in terms of chords, and we want to make the part “look like it sounds”. However, you have to look at what else is happening in the music and consider the instrument to make the best decision for any performer. You may make different choices for different instruments.
Final note: For sight-reading, our house style is to avoid accidental f-flats, e-sharps, c-flats, and b-sharps whenever possible. Exceptions would include when it prevents a keyboard player from seeing the shape of a chord. We often have discussions among proofreaders and come to a consensus about the best choice of accidental in an ambiguous situation.
Final note: For sight-reading, our house style is to avoid accidental f-flats, e-sharps, c-flats, and b-sharps whenever possible. Exceptions would include when it prevents a keyboard player from seeing the shape of a chord. We often have discussions among proofreaders and come to a consensus about the best choice of accidental in an ambiguous situation.
jbuhler
Senior Member
It seems this example is interesting because of the particular notes involved. It might use G# throughout but substitute E# for F. Or vice versa Ab throughout but substitute Fb for E. But that means either E# or Fb neither note is especially friendly.
Then too it depends on the harmony. If it’s a Db major/minor then you’d definitely want to write the Fb (or write it in C# major/minor with sharps). If it’s a so-called Slide progression from F minor to E major then what you have is fine unless you are thinking of the Slide as a half-step harmonic displacement of the fifth, in which case you might hold either the G# or the Ab constant depending on which “chord” you take as being primary. Others have pointed to different harmonic situations that might alter how you write the part.
It's A flat - F and then A flat - E. E is the leading tone for F in F minor. If it is F minor. I can't see the rest of the score, but since you emphasize the F, it probably is F minor. G sharp is an enharmonic notation. You do not go from a flat key to a sharp key. It's F minor all the way.
John Wilson
Member
Thanks for the advice on this, helped to clarify some things and ended up deciding to keep it how I currently have it
John Wilson
Member
This was my thinking on this, and changing the spellings would seem to result in needing to substitute either E# for F or an Fb for E, but I certainly do want to avoid using any E# or Fb.
John Wilson
Member
radamantissenior
Member
If it's F minor must be A flat always here. I don't know the accompaniment but this sounds to me like F minor (harmonic minor), Ab - E - Ab - Ab - E - Ab - E it's the correct way if it's F harmonic minor. Need more context.
JohnG
Senior Member
At the risk of stating the obvious...
we are seeing in this thread disagreements between worlds and geographic practices. If I were recording a film or game score in Los Angeles I probably would write G-sharp. Elsewhere, I probably also would, but I'd ask a local copyist.
Things are not the same in every geography, nor between media music recording and concert practice, and people in different spheres can be obdurate about what's "correct."
(also, as others have pointed out, I hesitate to give a definitive answer without seeing more of the passage and the other parts)
we are seeing in this thread disagreements between worlds and geographic practices. If I were recording a film or game score in Los Angeles I probably would write G-sharp. Elsewhere, I probably also would, but I'd ask a local copyist.
Things are not the same in every geography, nor between media music recording and concert practice, and people in different spheres can be obdurate about what's "correct."
(also, as others have pointed out, I hesitate to give a definitive answer without seeing more of the passage and the other parts)
