Dang that Beethoven!
- Thread starter Sean J
- Start date
kgdrum
“Making a mess & calling it Art is where it’s at!”
Beethoven’s later string quartets knock me out every time I hear them, not to mention the countless masterpieces like Symphony 6,7,9 etc….. Triple Concerto,Missa Solemnis and so on. The man the legend even hundreds of years later,is still a relevant major force in the music world.
kgdrum
“Making a mess & calling it Art is where it’s at!”
Thanks,lol I think I’m covered
I’m a drummer coming from a Jazz,Rock background that loves and appreciates all types of genres and unique trailblazers.
I guess Beethoven had enough an impact on me, I’m looking at my music server as of now I have 34 LVB albums. I’m not sure how many vinyl LP’s but I’ll guess at least a couple of dozen. Yes I’m a Beethoven fan!
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Barrel Maker
Member
I always loved how matter-of-factly Leonard Bernstein phrased it:
... Quite a compliment coming from Lenny.
Double Helix
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Well excuuuuuuse me (el oh el)Thanks,lol I think I’m covered
Lost during my many moves in my younger years was the boxed set of the symphonies by von Karajan & the Berlin Philharmonic on Deutsch Grammophon.I’m not sure how many vinyl LP’s but I’ll guess at least a couple of dozen. Yes I’m a Beethoven fan!
Though he was not my favorite conductor, the performances and recordings were what I considered definitive for the 1970s-80s.
In my view, the second movement of the Ninth is the all-timer
kgdrum
“Making a mess & calling it Art is where it’s at!”
@Double Helix
I wasn’t being dismissive or snarky towards your kind gesture,most appreciated.
The 9th is one of my favorites I have probably 5 versions,honestly I prefer listening to something like this on a good playback system YouTube and classical music is definitely not my preferred way of listening to great recordings.
I find it amazing how polarizing different conductors interpretations can be, Otto Klemperer was another great conductor people either loved or hated with Beethoven’s masterpieces.
For all of the trivia buffs: Klemperer was the father in real life of the actor most of us know as Colonel Klink from Hogans Hero’s!
Thanks
I wasn’t being dismissive or snarky towards your kind gesture,most appreciated.The 9th is one of my favorites I have probably 5 versions,honestly I prefer listening to something like this on a good playback system YouTube and classical music is definitely not my preferred way of listening to great recordings.
I find it amazing how polarizing different conductors interpretations can be, Otto Klemperer was another great conductor people either loved or hated with Beethoven’s masterpieces.
For all of the trivia buffs: Klemperer was the father in real life of the actor most of us know as Colonel Klink from Hogans Hero’s!
Thanks
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Sean J
Noise Maker
That's me with Mahler's 8th. Agree on the rest.
Marcus Millfield
Senior Member
Now I have to listen to the whole performance while working. Not a bad Friday, is it 
kgdrum
“Making a mess & calling it Art is where it’s at!”
Way back in 1980 my late father mentioned one day that he had purchased an entire boxed collection of Mahler lp’s. He didn’t have the patience & couldn’t stand Mahler’s slow winding musical approach. He knew I loved jazz, rock etc….he was shocked to find out Mahler,Bartok,Stravinsky as well as many other classical composers we’re personal hero’s of mine.
More than 40 years later the complete Mahler boxed set is still my most prized possession I got from my dad!
b_elliott
A work in progress.
I have been getting good mileage this past month on repeat listens to B's 7th. I even downloaded a pdf score of this symphony from IMSLP to study along.
The 3rd mvt strikes me as if one plunges into an ocean where things go calm, serene (referring to its hymn passages).
I read Beethoven considered the 7th as one of his finest creations. Whether true or not, my money is on what I am hearing: (cued to the 3rd mvt)
The 3rd mvt strikes me as if one plunges into an ocean where things go calm, serene (referring to its hymn passages).
I read Beethoven considered the 7th as one of his finest creations. Whether true or not, my money is on what I am hearing: (cued to the 3rd mvt)
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Sean J
Noise Maker
Same here.
I keep trying to write with as much detail and wondering what I'm missing.
- Motif, the overall form... I'm paying attention to in each note.
- But when I try to orchestrate (instrumentation & phrasing, not chord spelling), I...
Normally that's not hard for me at all. I usually do that at the expense of form (which I'm trying to address). The only thing on my mind is that maybe I need to step away from StaffPad, write it more in my head, then put it down. We'll see.
That said, if anyone has any writing insights they've heard in Beethoven and found noteworthy, I'd be interested.
cuttime
Senior Member
It's hard to comment on insights in to blinding genius, especially from a mere mortal like me, but I do know Beethoven sketched, wrote, re-wrote, sketched more and re-wrote. It was a torturous process for him and his manuscripts were a bloody mess, especially when compared to someone like Mozart, who claimed to almost be taking dictation. The differences in their output is stark, both in volume and quality. Not trying to besmirch Mozart, but a great deal of his music is formulaic and trite IMHO. He did create works of great genius no doubt, usually in minor keys, but a lot was written to keep food (or wine) on the table. I think Beethoven had art in mind for nearly all his work.Same here.
I keep trying to write with as much detail and wondering what I'm missing.
- Motif, the overall form... I'm paying attention to in each note.
- But when I try to orchestrate (instrumentation & phrasing, not chord spelling), I...
Normally that's not hard for me at all. I usually do that at the expense of form (which I'm trying to address). The only thing on my mind is that maybe I need to step away from StaffPad, write it more in my head, then put it down. We'll see.
That said, if anyone has any writing insights they've heard in Beethoven and found noteworthy, I'd be interested.
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cuttime
Senior Member
I do think it could be worth discussing his deafness and how it affected his writing. I had a music teacher that swore up and down that LVB would have re-written parts of the 9th had he been able to hear them, especially the horn cadenza in the Adagio. He said the triplet pizzicato accompaniment in the Adagio didn't work either. I'm not one to second guess Beethoven, but there are some odd moments and dissonances in the 9th that do kind of stick out, perhaps because the conductors I've heard perform it never really pulled it off...I dunno...
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Sean J
Noise Maker
I've never heard anyone describe genius as blinding, but yes... I like this.
b_elliott
A work in progress.
Wish I had some insight to share, but I had heard about LvB's notebooks, the constant reworkings vs Mzt's effortless composing style; but still, I think they each entered a flow state where magic happened. If it was the drinking water, I'd buy a barrel....
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Sean J
Noise Maker
Fair enough. I guess I should remember that. If it were that common of knowledge, we'd all be doing it.
In my mind, it's "just keep writing". Action is the test of excellence, etc.
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Sean J
Noise Maker
FYI, I posted in a separate thread about my form woes. I didn't want to continue that here as this is more genuinely a Beethoven Appreciation group at this point.
See, horns are my angels. Trumpets are an optional garnish.
See, horns are my angels. Trumpets are an optional garnish.
