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Some questions about SONUSCORE-THE ORCHESTRA

TigerTheFrog

Amphibiousician
So, what you're saying is that with The Orchestra Complete, it:
1) Does include the Strings of Winter ?, and,
2) Does not have a separate interface for Strings of Winter ?

Talk about confusing!!
There is a VI called The Strings of Winter that can be purchased separately.

There is The Orchestra Complete, which integrates all the instruments in The Strings of Winter into The Orchestra Complete. So you get the new string articulations added to the old string articulations. I think they made this pretty clear.

Over time, I am sure there will be many new libraries in The Orchestra Series
Maybe The Brass of Spring, the Woodwinds of Autumn, the Drums of Summer. Anybody who wants to buy one of those separately, will be able to do so. They won't need to own The Orchestra.

But The Orchestra Complete will continue to grow. There will be more instruments and more articulations, and probably more world instruments.

@Ashermusic Knowing the way Sonuscore monitors customer feedback, I am sure that there will be an English Horn in a future library. :) In fact, I think if enough people campaign online for any missing orchestral instrument, it's likely to be added.
 

dzilizzi

I just hang around pretending I know something
Yup. It is neither English nor is it exactly a horn, and the original cor angle (meaning "angled", not "anglais") is a mistranslation from the French. So perhaps its omission is its own fault, a result of its etymological dishonesty.
Well now I'm just totally confused. It's a French not quite horn that is trying to scam us into believing it is English? And then it wants to be part of the orchestra with a fancy name instead of being called an Angled Oboe?

Sigh. These instruments really need to stop this oneupmanship. :)
 

Quasar

Senior Member
Well now I'm just totally confused. It's a French not quite horn that is trying to scam us into believing it is English? And then it wants to be part of the orchestra with a fancy name instead of being called an Angled Oboe?

Sigh. These instruments really need to stop this oneupmanship. :)
Why do you think they're called "double reeds"? Because they double-deal like that. You can't trust them. :dancedance:
 

vitocorleone123

Active Member
I'm liking the looks/sound of The Orchestra (yes, Hollywood Gold can sound better etc. and can be cheaper, which it is as I write this, but I'm looking for ease of use + quality so am looking elsewhere for my first full orchestral library). However, there's a newcomer on the block, with a pre-order price $50 less than The Orchestra Complete, and then $50 more at regular price: Audio Imperia Nucleus.

Does anyone with The Orchestra also have experience with Audio Imperia (e.g., Jaeger) and would be willing to engage in speculation? Thanks!
 

AndyP

Active Member
Does anyone with The Orchestra also have experience with Audio Imperia (e.g., Jaeger) and would be willing to engage in speculation? Thanks!
I like to use TO as a starter for rhythmic backgrounds and ostinatos.
But because of the midiexport I exchange most of the sounds later.
Nucleus will be officially released on September 8th, so nobody can answer this question yet. But the demos sound very convincing and since it is a small library I ordered Nucleus, which is rather unusual for me, in pre-sale.
 

Geomir

Active Member
I like to use TO as a starter for rhythmic backgrounds and ostinatos.
But because of the midiexport I exchange most of the sounds later.
Nucleus will be officially released on September 8th, so nobody can answer this question yet. But the demos sound very convincing and since it is a small library I ordered Nucleus, which is rather unusual for me, in pre-sale.
So now you have been using both libraries... Is it true that Nucleus Core sounds better than The Orchestra? (Why do I get the feeling that The Orchestra is a little overpriced product?)

Also if I remember correct, you put The Orchestra "above" Iconica Ensembles?

So for you, that own all these products, it's Nucleus Core > The Orchestra > Iconica Ensembles?
 

Geomir

Active Member
I am going through my libraries and I just released that both the Native Instruments Symphony Series Solo Library and Sonuscore's The Orchestra don't have an English horn. The former has saxes, but no English horn. The latter has contrabassoon but no English horn.

What are these guys thinking?
I couldn't agree more! What the hell they were thinking? I believe that kind of decisions is what make this $500 library almost totally ignored in all the discussions about "What woodwinds library to buy"?

English Horn's absent is the most important problem for sure! But for that kind of price, such libraries usually have 2 flutes (actually 5, if you include piccolo, alto and bass flute), 1-2 oboes, 1-2 English Horns, and - of course - bass clarinet (with its nice deep distinct sound)!

Saxophone? Really? Is this some kind of jazz library? And just think that this library costs as the FULL EWHO Gold!

But I have to admit something! It's thanks to this library that I learnt that saxophone is actually a woodwind instrument! Seriously now! Come on, how many knew about this? Ask 99 people and will tell you for sure that saxophone is a brass instrument!

P.S. No comments about The Orchestra, because - at least - it's cheaper, and its purpose is mainly all these full orchestra patches, ensembles, rhythms, etc... So OK, no English Horn there... I suppose it's not as important as the "typical trio" flute+oboe+clarinet in high woodwinds ensembles.
 

AndyP

Active Member
Every library has its strengths and weaknesses. The Orchestra is a tool for composition that can make a lot of work easier. It also helps to find ideas, especially since it offers many articulations for the strings.
The strings are not bad at all, some of them I like to use very much, especially in the lower registers.
Nucleus has an overall better, cleaner and clearer sound without noise, better legatos, solo instruments. Unfortunately there are some articulations missing which I replace with other libs (e.g. thrills for strings).
Both have their place on my macbook and I think the prices are justified.

The sound of the Iconica ensembles is very good, but I don't like the legatos, and the dynamic range is too low for me. They don't offer me anything I don't already have and so I decided against Iconica. It's also a matter of taste and they didn't hit mine.

I covered my needs for sketching (Symphobia 1-3, TO, Nucleus, BHCT). In principle, all areas are well covered (especially drum, string and brass libs), but there are always new tools that are an enrichment, such as Time Micro from Orchestra Tools. Drum and percussion libraries used to be my passion, but I've found my setup with which I'm absolutely happy. For this area it was easier than e.g. in the orchestra area.

The sound of the BBCSO appeals to me and I will probably order it too. So far EWHO and VSL Synchron-ized are my orchestral library, they are not sorted out either, but I also feel the need to try something new that sounds more modern and different. I like the tools of spitfire and OT that provide rhythmic textures, which is an enormous enrichment and breathes new life into it. I find the libs I have no worse, they are different. When someone asks me if I need new libs, I say no, I don't.

I will decide when more information is available.

Since I like to make experimental music besides classical music and heavy metal, there can't be enough possibilities.

Fortunately I don't have to worry about the budget. But if I had to calculate with every cent I would limit myself to 3-4 of the most important tools, think about exactly what I want to do beforehand and research exactly which librarys best serve this purpose. The choice in the years became frighteningly large, but I also see advantages in it.

The general best tool doesn't exist and I don't think it will ever exist. That's up to the users and fortunately the tastes are different.
 

sostenuto

Big NKS Fan !
H
Every library has its strengths and weaknesses. The Orchestra is a tool for composition that can make a lot of work easier. It also helps to find ideas, especially since it offers many articulations for the strings.
The strings are not bad at all, some of them I like to use very much, especially in the lower registers.
Nucleus has an overall better, cleaner and clearer sound without noise, better legatos, solo instruments. Unfortunately there are some articulations missing which I replace with other libs (e.g. thrills for strings).
Both have their place on my macbook and I think the prices are justified.

The sound of the Iconica ensembles is very good, but I don't like the legatos, and the dynamic range is too low for me. They don't offer me anything I don't already have and so I decided against Iconica. It's also a matter of taste and they didn't hit mine.

I covered my needs for sketching (Symphobia 1-3, TO, Nucleus, BHCT). In principle, all areas are well covered (especially drum, string and brass libs), but there are always new tools that are an enrichment, such as Time Micro from Orchestra Tools. Drum and percussion libraries used to be my passion, but I've found my setup with which I'm absolutely happy. For this area it was easier than e.g. in the orchestra area.

The sound of the BBCSO appeals to me and I will probably order it too. So far EWHO and VSL Synchron-ized are my orchestral library, they are not sorted out either, but I also feel the need to try something new that sounds more modern and different. I like the tools of spitfire and OT that provide rhythmic textures, which is an enormous enrichment and breathes new life into it. I find the libs I have no worse, they are different. When someone asks me if I need new libs, I say no, I don't.

I will decide when more information is available.

Since I like to make experimental music besides classical music and heavy metal, there can't be enough possibilities.

Fortunately I don't have to worry about the budget. But if I had to calculate with every cent I would limit myself to 3-4 of the most important tools, think about exactly what I want to do beforehand and research exactly which librarys best serve this purpose. The choice in the years became frighteningly large, but I also see advantages in it.

The general best tool doesn't exist and I don't think it will ever exist. That's up to the users and fortunately the tastes are different.
Your coverage is really spot-on and timely, having TO and leaning to TO_Complete @ $123. Upgrade.
Have Symphobia, BHCT, OT-Time Macro and now -Micro, so Nucleus is a stretch.
I trust you have not run across notable TO-Complete ( Strings of Winter ) concerns.
 

AndyP

Active Member
Your coverage is really spot-on and timely, having TO and leaning to TO_Complete @ $123. Upgrade.
Have Symphobia, BHCT, OT-Time Macro and now -Micro, so Nucleus is a stretch.
I trust you have not run across notable TO-Complete ( Strings of Winter ) concerns.
Strings of winter are a win in TO. Unusual sound, but I think it's really good. Additionally there were further improvements with the update like the midi export, or further articulations for the already existing strings. I am curious what more updates will come and I know that Sonuscore is working on further updates.
Even if I don't find all sounds (woodwinds) good, there is enough useful stuff in it that makes the library valuable for me.
I think TO is great, you can quickly build bombastic layers and it's perfect for that.
At Symphobia today I am increasingly bothered by the few RR. I have always liked to use short strings, but less and less. But Symphobia has strengthened others that I still appreciate.
Nucleus is the perfect complement because good woodwinds, solo instruments, very good legato.
With these librarys alone you can do nearly everything (the only weakness is that there's no real piano.).
 

sostenuto

Big NKS Fan !
This reinforcement for TO Complete is perfect .... ready to purchase. Nucleus deserves more attention and will invest serious time. Footprint and cost is very attractive.

Have had almost all Sonokinetics (except (2) latest _ Indie & Largo). So much content and far from sorting most useful libs .....

Pianist /organist here, and no end to interesting possibilities out there. Currently, Ivory II Italian remains go-to ... backed up by NI_K12U pianos, Addictive Keys, OTS EV Rosewood Grand, Embertone 1955 Walker D, Waves Grand Rhapsody.

THX and regards
 

Geomir

Active Member
Every library has its strengths and weaknesses. The Orchestra is a tool for composition that can make a lot of work easier. It also helps to find ideas, especially since it offers many articulations for the strings.
The strings are not bad at all, some of them I like to use very much, especially in the lower registers.
Nucleus has an overall better, cleaner and clearer sound without noise, better legatos, solo instruments. Unfortunately there are some articulations missing which I replace with other libs (e.g. thrills for strings).
Both have their place on my macbook and I think the prices are justified.

The sound of the Iconica ensembles is very good, but I don't like the legatos, and the dynamic range is too low for me. They don't offer me anything I don't already have and so I decided against Iconica. It's also a matter of taste and they didn't hit mine.

I covered my needs for sketching (Symphobia 1-3, TO, Nucleus, BHCT). In principle, all areas are well covered (especially drum, string and brass libs), but there are always new tools that are an enrichment, such as Time Micro from Orchestra Tools. Drum and percussion libraries used to be my passion, but I've found my setup with which I'm absolutely happy. For this area it was easier than e.g. in the orchestra area.

The sound of the BBCSO appeals to me and I will probably order it too. So far EWHO and VSL Synchron-ized are my orchestral library, they are not sorted out either, but I also feel the need to try something new that sounds more modern and different. I like the tools of spitfire and OT that provide rhythmic textures, which is an enormous enrichment and breathes new life into it. I find the libs I have no worse, they are different. When someone asks me if I need new libs, I say no, I don't.

I will decide when more information is available.

Since I like to make experimental music besides classical music and heavy metal, there can't be enough possibilities.

Fortunately I don't have to worry about the budget. But if I had to calculate with every cent I would limit myself to 3-4 of the most important tools, think about exactly what I want to do beforehand and research exactly which librarys best serve this purpose. The choice in the years became frighteningly large, but I also see advantages in it.

The general best tool doesn't exist and I don't think it will ever exist. That's up to the users and fortunately the tastes are different.
That's a really detailed answer, thank you!

From all the demos I have heard I can only agree with you that Strings of Winter have a unique original sound! And I am really interested because I really love the idea of frozen landscapes in my music! Also as you said the extra articulations make The Orchestra really more "Complete" than ever, strings articulation go way further than being "basic/core/essential"!

WOW for sure you covered your needs for sketching, you have some really nice libraries! So you own also Symphobias! Right now in this forum, Symphobia 1 sells for $200 and TO Complete for $220! Would you choose TO Complete for your 1st main sketch library?

I am mainly interested in full patches, i.e. full strings, full woodwinds, full brass, AND full orchestral patches! EWHO shines in the individual sections, the sound and the possible articulations can cover almost all my needs, but I could use the help of full orchestral patches!

Thank you for your input about Nucleus and Iconica! I noticed you also own VSL synchronized. How would you compare the SOLO stings and SOLO woodwinds of VSL vs Nucleus Core (the few ones that Nucleus has).

P.S. Without having any serious budget limitations, how did you manage to avoid so far all Albion products for your sketching needs? :)
 

Geomir

Active Member
I'm liking the looks/sound of The Orchestra (yes, Hollywood Gold can sound better etc. and can be cheaper, which it is as I write this, but I'm looking for ease of use + quality so am looking elsewhere for my first full orchestral library). However, there's a newcomer on the block, with a pre-order price $50 less than The Orchestra Complete, and then $50 more at regular price: Audio Imperia Nucleus.

Does anyone with The Orchestra also have experience with Audio Imperia (e.g., Jaeger) and would be willing to engage in speculation? Thanks!
So did you make the final step to buy your first full orchestral library? Or are you still planning? I know first hand that it's a hard decision, especially if you are not a pro musician (or have a low budget anyway), because your final choice will be your main tool for your next several projects (whatever they are)! :)

For me in the end it was EWHO Gold, both the sound quality and content for the price is just unbeatable!

But even if the quality of the sound and the number of articulations of EWHO beat even more expensive (and newer) libraries, still it could not be your best choice, because, unlike some other libraries you may be "watching" and are interested-in, it does not contain harps, piano, choirs, etc... I happen to own some dedicated harp libraries and a nice dedicated choir library, plus some decent grand piano virtual instruments, so EWHO was a perfect buy for me, actually I was happy it lacks this "extra instruments", because I know that all the money (and all the GBs in my SSD drive!) I spent was exactly what I needed!

Already AndyP's replies were really helpful here, because he owns these products and he is having first-hand experience with them!
 
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AndyP

Active Member
Pianist /organist here, and no end to interesting possibilities out there. Currently, Ivory II Italian remains go-to ... backed up by NI_K12U pianos, Addictive Keys, OTS EV Rosewood Grand, Embertone 1955 Walker D, Waves Grand Rhapsody.

THX and regards
I have to listen to Ivory II again, I already had that on my list and then bought something else.
I'm thrilled with the Steinway D-274 which came with the Synchron update. Just for that the update price was a joke.
 

AndyP

Active Member
Thank you for your input about Nucleus and Iconica! I noticed you also own VSL synchronized. How would you compare the SOLO stings and SOLO woodwinds of VSL vs Nucleus Core (the few ones that Nucleus has).

P.S. Without having any serious budget limitations, how did you manage to avoid so far all Albion products for your sketching needs? :)
Albion had too much content for me that I didn't need and so others came into the selection. Not having single sections for instrument groups was the exclusion criterion. Even if the budget is good, I (mostly) only buy what I consider useful for my purposes.

Exception so far is the BHCT because I like the composition of the instrumentation, which sounded excellent and I can fill the gaps with other libs. In general I find the BHCT as all library in one to be the best. At least for what I want to do with it.

I still see no reason to buy the Albions. Maybe Iceni if it goes into the sale.

VSL is a fine library, but sometimes it sounds a bit sterile which is no disadvantage, it serves other purposes. The Woodwinds in VSL are my first choice when I'm in my home studio. Nucleus is different in sound, but equal and the legatos of the solo instruments are good enough to stay in the final mix.
In the end it's always a mixture of many different librarys.
 

Geomir

Active Member
Albion had too much content for me that I didn't need and so others came into the selection. Not having single sections for instrument groups was the exclusion criterion. Even if the budget is good, I (mostly) only buy what I consider useful for my purposes.

Exception so far is the BHCT because I like the composition of the instrumentation, which sounded excellent and I can fill the gaps with other libs. In general I find the BHCT as all library in one to be the best. At least for what I want to do with it.

I still see no reason to buy the Albions. Maybe Iceni if it goes into the sale.

VSL is a fine library, but sometimes it sounds a bit sterile which is no disadvantage, it serves other purposes. The Woodwinds in VSL are my first choice when I'm in my home studio. Nucleus is different in sound, but equal and the legatos of the solo instruments are good enough to stay in the final mix.
In the end it's always a mixture of many different librarys.
Of course having no problem with your budget doesn't mean that you are going to start buying useless (for you) libraries! From the other hand, specifically with music libraries, this danger is always lurking nearby! :)

So BHCT is an organic library? It's true that it's not very commonly mentioned here, and I have not read many opinions about it.

So from all the products you have ever used, what do you consider the most useful for full strings, full brass, full woodwinds and full orchestral patches? (I am mainly interested in patches that spread into all the keyboard, not the ones that split the keyboard to 2 or 3 or more parts!)
 

AndyP

Active Member
Of course having no problem with your budget doesn't mean that you are going to start buying useless (for you) libraries! From the other hand, specifically with music libraries, this danger is always lurking nearby! :)

So BHCT is an organic library? It's true that it's not very commonly mentioned here, and I have not read many opinions about it.

So from all the products you have ever used, what do you consider the most useful for full strings, full brass, full woodwinds and full orchestral patches? (I am mainly interested in patches that spread into all the keyboard, not the ones that split the keyboard to 2 or 3 or more parts!)
BHCT is a little niche and has a more intimate dryer spatial sound. Is not a big orchestra, rather chamber size.
I can't recommend pure ensemble librarys because I don't have one. BHCT is basically one, but I guess it doesn't deliver what you're looking for. It is not an epic library.

Palette of redroom audio is an ensemble library that has been mentioned here from time to time. It is quite complete, but has no legato or solo instruments. The Specs and the Demos didn't convince me so much, but maybe it meets your taste.

Or Kirk Hunter ensembles. Small, sounds fine, but in my opinion is a bit too expensive for the normal price.

Amadeus is highly praised by many.
 

Geomir

Active Member
BHCT is a little niche and has a more intimate dryer spatial sound. Is not a big orchestra, rather chamber size.
I can't recommend pure ensemble librarys because I don't have one. BHCT is basically one, but I guess it doesn't deliver what you're looking for. It is not an epic library.

Palette of redroom audio is an ensemble library that has been mentioned here from time to time. It is quite complete, but has no legato or solo instruments. The Specs and the Demos didn't convince me so much, but maybe it meets your taste.

Or Kirk Hunter ensembles. Small, sounds fine, but in my opinion is a bit too expensive for the normal price.

Amadeus is highly praised by many.
OK you are right, all those sketch libraries you own are not 100% only ensemble libraries! But I think they offer many patches of mixed orchestra, i.e. strings+brass, strings+woodwinds, strings+brass+woodwinds ensembles, etc...

I think Symphobia has some nice "inspiring categories" like action, drama, suspense, featuring various orchestral mixes, and The Orchestra has various Full Orchestra patches, ready to use out of the box. That's what I meant when I mentioned Full Ensembles, I wan not referring to the size. It doens't need to be huge!

Based on your experience, do you like more Symphobia 1 or The Orchestra Complete for those mixed orchestra patches? Could you say that one of them sounds more impressive than the other? Or you respect both the same?

LOL about Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra, if anyone praises this library, it must have been for the 2 following reasons:

1) The price! It was selling 99 intro price and now sells for 149. It's very cheap, so it's considered nice value for money, but I am not going to use it ever again, too many problems.
2) Cory Pelizzari's amazing "Library Spotlight" review! This guy is better than Amadeus Orchestra itself! :) He plays the instruments in his wonderful way, that not even the creators of the Library could do so! This review convinced many people to buy Amadeus...

It's true Amadeus has a full mixed orchestra ensemble patch, but it's extremely limited in articulations and options.
 
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