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Need some good medieval/renaissance "folk" instruments.

With respect to the close mic discussion, have any of you used a tool like Virtual Sound Stage (2)? I routinely use this with select instruments from Tari's libraries, as it adds both a bit of depth and placement, especially in the context of a larger ensemble or orchestra. That before any eq or reverb in the chain. Just a thought...
 
Thank you for the hint gpax. All my instruments go to VSS2 before going to the master but that does not change Taris somewhat "in your face" sound. My remarks are not about the controversy of close mics to far mics but about how the close mics are recorded.
 
So I settled in with a few hearty stouts this weekend and made the quick thing I promised earlier. I started off using only Era II instruments, but I picked up Dark Era and wanted to try it out, so there's a tagelharpa, an ancient lyre, and a pair of skin drums in there now too.

https://www.averystemmler.com/music/Personal/Casks_and_Barrels_v2.mp3

I'm pretty happy with the sense of depth I was able to get out of them. The rest of the mix sounds good to my tired ears but is probably a trashfire.
 
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Consona said:
I see that in the opposite way. Sampling instruments too close actually does not capture the essence. We never hear instruments playing right in our ears, most of the time, we hear them in a hall, a big room, etc. It's the interaction with an environment that co-creates the sound of an instrument.
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+1
 
I'm a player who has well over 3000 concerts behind him during the course of his lifetime, so I MOSTLY hear the "close perspective" and prefer it even when in the audience (I like chamber music better than big orchestras; the intimacy is more emotionally involving for me in most cases).

I wonder if those of us who prefer close mics and dry recording conditions, are mostly players, or if it's just a matter of random personal taste?
 
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Definitely it is a matter of tastes, but using close mics doesn't mean you don't get the room. Just try to record close mics in a bathroom or in your bedroom :-D ...To me close mics means the perfect way to have the best of both worlds: the nuances from the instrument (air from flutes, string sound. etc) and a slight good room sound that will make the instrument sound better and will allow you to use your own reverb.
 
Just to put my own preferences in perspective, my company developed and patented a special system for electronically altering room acoustics. The main person behind this system engineered almost half of Decca's classical recordings, and that is one of our main target audiences. Not sound reinforcement, as that replaces the point source. But it's WAY more advanced than convolution (which is a part of the process nonetheless).

Dialing in the right amount so that it sounds natural, as though it is part of the room vs. altering the instrument's sense of where it is, is the hardest part, so we have to have highly trained operators who deal with that. And LOTS of microphones are involved!

Anyway, being semi-involved in that, watching Vienna MIR, WIVI, and other approaches to spatial aspects of acoustics, has made me more sensitive to baked-in large hall sounds in sample libraries, but also aware of what can be added vs. enhanced. So yes, 100% dry/anechoic isn't good either -- this is why the Sample Modeling stuff, other than for the lower-frequency instruments, can be hard to work convincingly into an orchestral perspective vs. using it for jazz, pop, reggae/ska, etc.
 
Sid Francis said:
My remarks are not about the controversy of close mics to far mics but about how the close mics are recorded.
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Yea, I was comparing close recordings of Spitfire's Andy Findon Kit Bag and Forest Kingdom II flutes and Kit Bag has way more richer and fuller sound. So it must be the equipment used and/or sampling technique (distance from the mic or whatever factors there could be).

TARI said:
Dark Era recordings are killer!! believe me :)
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Watched @Dirk Ehlert 's video and liked the sound, but can't comment more on this since it requires hands on experience. So maybe one day... :)

I'd really love to hear those instruments sampled by some other companies to have some points of reference when judging the sound.
 
I also am sticking with Kit Bag for the most part, for those specific instruments, and it's because the timbre seems much richer and deeper, likely due to miking techniques.

I remain mystified why those libraries got pulled down so low; it's rare that I have to add vs. subtract from the volume output of a Kontakt Library, but some of those have to be pushed up to +6 dB or even +12 dB! And I'm someone who records at -24 dBFS for the averages.
 
I've been using those ever since 1999 or so, when they were first released for the Yamaha MOTIF DAW Workstation Keyboard. It was the first Bagpipe library to offer a proper Drone.
 
I really like them, they sound very good and it is a great addition for MOTIF MODX. The bolder sound celtic pipes are similar and the multi patch detune is a big win, so its great to layer them to get a bigger sound.
 
I really like Flying Hand Percussion for these kinds of tavern-band rhythm beds. Really nice detail and a good range of drums appropriate for fantasy/medieval settings:

www.handheldsound.com

FlyingHand Percussion – HandheldSound

highlights instruments features & tech video & audio requirements & info reviews $ Add to Cart the highlights FlyingHand Percussion is a dedicated Hand-Percussion sample library. With over 30,000 samples, it represents an authentic and evocative ensemble utilizing a great number of...
www.handheldsound.com www.handheldsound.com
 
Mason said:
I have a lot of this and I recommend:

Highland Harps by Impact Soundworks (has a lyre and lap harp)

The Conservatoire Collection by Soniccouture (not worth full price IMO and hard on CPU, but have some good things)

Balkan Ethnic Orchestra (Awesome flutes, zourna and more, some beautiful soundscapes/pads as well)

Ilya Efimov’s Uilleann Pipes and accordion

Tarilonte’s Era 2
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+1 for The Conservatoire Collection
 
averystemmler said:
I think a fairer statement would be that Era instruments take a bit of work to polish and fit into a mix. That I'll certainly agree with. They're very dry, so have an EQ and your favorite reverb at the ready.
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I think it's more than just EQ. I agree with Sid. I find them extremely clumsy.
 
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