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Kontakt Updates (current version: 6.6.1)

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EvilDragon

EvilDragon

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Not just for Kontakt but generally a lot of issue's we can tend to have with our DAW is internet related, because there are to many things that are going on in the background while quietly changing things to another state that they was not before,

Except the missing samples dialog doesn't have anything to do with Internet connectivity, nor can any background things affect it to such an extent. Sorry but you're being way off-base here.
 

novaburst

Senior Member
I have not got the Kontakt state message since isolating my machine s from the internet I have done about 8 or 9 boots of the machine and DAW this could be a coincidence but I will stay off line as long as a I can to see if the message does come back.

One thing that I needed to do was do another VEpro instance as the previous one would not fully boot when off line, but did boot when I was on line,
How strange is that.

I am becoming fully convinced that our machine behaviour and programs (DAW) are strongly influenced by the internet activity in the back ground of our machines.

I will monitor my situation for a few weeks,

If I need to download any important things then will go on line only for that.
 

novaburst

Senior Member
nor can any background things affect it to such an extent. Sorry but you're being way off-base here.
Yes I think it does sound way off even to my self but I am going to give it a go and monitor the situation, so I am guessing I am going to see that Kontakt message soon but we will see
 
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EvilDragon

EvilDragon

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So, the "state message" is a NEW THING since K6.4, it's the new way to handle missing samples (as was mentioned already a few times in this thread). It didn't exist before 6.4 because missing samples case was handled differently - namely, Kontakt would create the Missing Content dialog upon loading the project directly. Since macOS Big Sur this is not allowed for plugins anymore (they cannot create their own dialogs on project load anymore), only basic system dialogs can be used, which is what prompted the "state of Kontakt" message, which tells the user that they need to manually open any one Kontakt instance in order to resolve missing content across ALL Kontakt instances in the whole project (which was also not even possible before, you had to resolve missing content one instance at a time, which can be quite an ordeal).

This has absolutely nothing to do with Internet connectivity, as you can see.
 

novaburst

Senior Member
This has absolutely nothing to do with
with me it's a honch, what I believe is going in is the operating system is being subtle changed, coursing the DAW and or Kontakt and other instruments that are hosted to respond in a bug like effect, because of these small changes that the internet coursed,

It doesn't make sense that Kontakt can boot up fine and stable once and twice and even perform good inside your host for a few days then suddenly act like it's buggy, there must be another influence coursing that behaviour,

All we or myself are doing Is booting up the same program each time we sit behind the machine I am not doing anything crazy like codes or in-depth programming most of the time it's just hitting the playback and record button

So there must be some movement and changes going on in the background of our machines that are prompting the DAW , host and player in this case Kontakt seems to be effected by an out side change that in turn effects the state of our DAW and host that courses conflict.

A reboot of the program normally resolves the issue but can have a tendency to grow worse as you load more instances,
 
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EvilDragon

EvilDragon

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You can believe whatever you want, but in this case it's wrong. :) I explained what "The state of some Kontakt instances cannot be recalled correctly" message means and why it's there. That's all there's to it.
 

novaburst

Senior Member
It's fine but since I have been practicing isolating from the net I have not a Kontakt message, anyway your probably correct,

But it is working what I am doing for now at least and no head bang, for now,

Any way I don't think it effects Kontakt directly I think it effects the host and then Kontakt so it's kind of indirect,

Plus another thing is it only effected the server machine and not once on the master machine

Anyways let's hope for a fix but again it could be indirect coming from our host

Cheers
 
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EvilDragon

EvilDragon

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That message ONLY shows up when there are missing samples and ONLY upon loading a DAW project. No way it would show up in the middle of a project.
 

novaburst

Senior Member
Yes correct, so upon booting up the host VEpro I would get the Kontakt state message then would need to reconnect the host in Cubase, or reboot VEpro and or Kontakt would be empty and I would need to put the library's in again this would happen on average 4 times out of 10 .times

As of now over 10 times booting up the host there has been no Kontakt state message.all machines off line only net worked. Master and server.
 

Obi-Wan Spaghetti

Senior Member
Someone here had a dropbox file for older Kontakt 6 versions that he was sharing to those who wanted an earlier version. I tried to PM you with it, but the file is too large.
Thanks for trying Robert.
edited: OK got it. Thanks again Robert.

I'll wait before i update next time. I guess you never know what's gonna happen.
 
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rrichard63

Perpetual Novice
I'll wait before i update next time. I guess you never know what's gonna happen.
If you keep your wits about you, there's no need to defer updating when new versions come out. Before telling Native Access to update, just save the executable and each of the plugin formats you have installed to a separate archive location. You could build a simple command line script to automate this. Then, when the new version misbehaves, just copy the archived files back to their working folders. I currently have six prior versions of Kontakt 5 and eight prior versions of Kontakt 6 in mothballs.

Credit where credit is due: I didn't figure this out for myself. I learned it from Evil Dragon.
 

Zhao Shen

StormSound
I've been having an issue where Kontakt (I'm on 6.6.1) crashes Cubase upon opening the project file. This only happens when there's a Kontakt instance with missing samples (either because samples moved or you chose to load an instrument while ignoring missing samples).

This thread perfectly describes the issue. This happened to me first when opening an old project file after I had moved some samples around, and then again after I added an instrument that I didn't have all the samples for. It's a pretty rough issue because it's hard to root cause and very slow to try different solutions with, especially if your project file is large.

In my experience, the only way to solve the issue is to disable the instance with missing samples, save, then close and re-open Cubase. You still have to deal with the missing sample issue at some point or else the crash will persist on future opens - I just renamed a random sample to get the error to go away. As it stands, Kontakt doesn't seem to play nicely with missing samples at all - maybe a bug introduced with the changes to the resolution process.
 
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jcrosby

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I've been having an issue where Kontakt (I'm on 6.6.1) crashes Cubase upon opening the project file. This only happens when there's a Kontakt instance with missing samples (either because samples moved or you chose to load an instrument while ignoring missing samples).

This thread perfectly describes the issue. This happened to me first when opening an old project file after I had moved some samples around, and then again after I added an instrument that I didn't have all the samples for. It's a pretty rough issue because it's hard to root cause and very slow to try different solutions with, especially if your project file is large.

In my experience, the only way to solve the issue is to disable the instance with missing samples, save, then close and re-open Cubase. You still have to deal with the missing sample issue at some point or else the crash will persist on future opens - I just renamed a random sample to get the error to go away. As it stands, Kontakt doesn't seem to play nicely with missing samples at all - maybe a bug introduced with the changes to the resolution process.
I've had the same issue in Logic. (Namely with @audioimperia Nucleus's last update...) Which seemed to behave just fine if I loaded "new" instruments from the browser; only after I attempted to load old project files, with nki references that didn't specifically link to their last update; then everything completely fell apart...

After exploring the behavior by manually moving other library's sample pools, Logic presents the same behavior as Nucleus... It appears the issue isn't just the Nucleus update alone, ( but the way they rolled out their last update was sloppy, as it clearly was not tested across DAWs thoroughly...) Instead of assuming things work across the board with Kontakt, they might want to test thoroughly to avoid potential headaches...

Overall it appears to be a the larger issue with Kontakt in general, but developers looking to roll out updates that require manual intervention outside of N.A. might consider testing the update in as many DAWs as possible, as some DAWs clearly still do not currently play well with Kontakt after NI implemented the behavior the leads to the message: "The state of some Kontakt instances cannot be recalled correctly" ....
 
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EvilDragon

EvilDragon

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As it stands, Kontakt doesn't seem to play nicely with missing samples at all - maybe a bug introduced with the changes to the resolution process.

The issue is more than Cubase is not playing nicely with Kontakt (especially with ASIO Guard enabled) when resolving samples. From my knowledge, Kontakt team did what they could to circumvent the issue, the ball is in Steinberg's court now.
 
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EvilDragon

EvilDragon

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Which seemed to behave just fine if I loaded "new" instruments from the browser; only after I attempted to load old project files, with nki references that didn't specifically link to their last update; then everything completely fell apart...

This sounds like they updated their scripts by overwriting the old script, yet kept the same exact NKR. So any old projects would link to the newest script, but if there were structural changes in the instruments themselves (i.e. groups, effects, modulators added or removed), this will break horribly.

There are two proper ways of dealing with this situation:

1. Make your update a completely new NKR and make only the updated NKIs point to it. Old NKIs (from old DAW projects etc) still point to the old NKR. This is what NI does when they update their libraries
2. Make your scripts and assets with different filenames per product update, keeping the singular NKR in your library. This way old NKIs (from old DAW projects etc) still point to the old scripts and assets, and freshly loaded updated NKIs also get what they need. This is what I do for the most part.
 
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